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I average out the spring and fall changes and just set my clocks 39 minutes ahead year-round.
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Wait a minute. I’m taking this four steps further for the benefit of all of humanity. Here we go.
One, we need to convert over to 24-hour time. No more of this ridiculous AM/PM confusing crap that makes calculating times confusing. What time is it? It’s 9. AM or PM? None of that. It’s 9. What time is it 8 hours after 9? It’s 9+8= 17. It’s 17. Not 5p. What the hell. Why did anyone even ever agree to this AM/PM garbage?
Two, we need to end time zones. They are ridiculous. What’s the point?? We could all work on GMT. Imagine, the entire world on one date. A whole worldwide party to celebrate the new year at the same time. International flight scheduling would be soooo intuitive. Your flight time is the arrival time minus the departure time without having to pull out a timezone map and consider daylights-savings to calculate it. What time is it on the International Space Station? The exact same time it is for the rest of humanity. Oh, but then half the world will be awake at night. Nope! They would just adjust their working/wake hours. Instead of the Eastern USA being open from 0900-1700, they would be open from 0400-1300. BTW, calculating that time difference was easy since it was on 24-hour time.
Three, we need to change over to the Julian calendar. What the hell are months even?? They don’t serve any purpose other than to sell calendars, maintain the legacy of ancient emperors that dissolved democracies, and gaslight us by telling us that Sept, Oct, Nov, and Dec mean 9th, 10th, 11th, and 12th. Get out of here with that crap. We’re not buying it. Also, you know who else doesn’t use 12-hour time and months?? The US military. They use GMT and Julian calendars for operational matters. Why? Because it makes sense for a global system to use the same thing everywhere!!
Fourth and lastly, we need to switch the year count to the Human Era. Stop with this whole year based on Jesus’ supposed birth or death**. Do we even know if it’s based on his birth or death? It doesn’t matter. Oh, but historians use Before Common Era and Common Era. Okay…and who’s life happens to line up perfectly with the split? That’s like saying that the American Civil Rights movement ended racism in the country, yet there’s still racial segregation and oppression. This is ridiculous. Civilization is letting the life of one person decide when it started?! What about everyone that lived before Jesus? Abroham? Cleopatra? Mark Antony (the full Roman, not the Romantic Puerto Rican)? the Buddha Llama? Sohcrateez? Confusion? Ea-nāṣir?! The correct year is when human civilization started. We are currently in the year 12,023 of the Human Era.
That’s it! We’ve had enough of this oppression propagated by Big Time, including Rolex, Casio, Fossil, and grandfather. This movement starts right here👇, right now👇! One☝🏿humanity. One☝🏾period in the day inconsiderate of the meridian. One☝🏽variable for the date in a year. One☝🏼love. One☝🏻time.
Edit: Right now at the time of this edit, it is 5:00 pm on October 25, 2023 EST (daylights savings time), or better yet, 12023-298-2100 (year-date-time). 31 characters (excluding that it’s daylights savings time!) vs. 14. Look at how simple 😮
We are all one system of humanity functioning on the same time, regardless of what anyone says. Right now is right now, no matter what we call it. It’s time we all progress to a better future at/on the same time.
They would just adjust their working/wake hours. Instead of the Eastern USA being open from 0900-1700, they would be open from 0400-1300.
Isn’t that just time zones again?
No because if you’re talking to someone on the other side of the planet (thanks internet), you can schedule some sort of event with them without having to look up the time difference before hand
Yeah but you need to know when they’d be sleeping, for example, so you still need to figure something out related to time differences.
You both just have present your working or availability hours beforehand. Honestly this works better for me than someone assuming I’m available for an 8am meeting. I live on the US east coast, but my sleeping schedule is more west coast.
Yeah I’m in the us east but work in a factory so I have to explain it anyways
What if you don’t want to ask for some specific reason? Time zones!
Checkmate!
Nope, that was a check! The reason of not wanting to ask for availability periods still exists with time zones.
Kind of, but not exactly. Those are the hours their businesses are open. However, this takes one variable out of the formula, which is calculating the time difference. Rather than having to know the time difference and business hours, you’d only have to know the business hours. Also, it would be even easier if you just shared your availability, which is what matters anyway, but you don’t have to calculate the time difference. There’s only one variable to communicate, which is the universal time they would be available. It’s super simple.
Julian calendar? No that’s silly. New calendar, 13 months, each is 28 days. You get one intercalary day for New Year’s, and a bonus one following our existing leap year schedule
The symmetry calendars are better. They don’t break the 7 day week cycle, they instead have a 52 week common year, a 53 week leap year, and a complex leap year formula
I would expect the leap week to be part of the end of year holiday
GMT is a time zone! UTC.
You’re always calling me out on my bullshit. I’m sick of this crap! 😋
I kind of half-heartedly agree with most of this, but the human era one is kind of stupid. I don’t really care about jesus’s birth or death or whatever, I just have no reason to add an extra 1 to the date for the next 10,000 years until I switch it to a 2. Mostly because I’ll be dead, but also because such a point would be so far in the future that I don’t know that any of this argument will be relevant at all.
Edit: also, you forgot the biggest one, which kind of goes along with months but not really: seasons. Lots of places don’t have four distinct seasons, they just have a wet season and a dry season, or a dry kind of summer and then a wet winter and then a dry winter, or whatever, which influences local ecology a lot. Moulding these around to roughly fit whatever any individual location’s season is, is kind of stupid. It’s better just to say what the actual season is, it’s less confusing, Everyone knows what everyone else means, it’s more specific. People have been tricked into thinking that the four seasons are a universal thing, they’re not, that’s false.
The same can be said about the thousands in the current year. We’ll basically wait 1000 years just to change the 2 into a 3.
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Where did you get the idea that the Julian calendar doesn’t have months? The Gregorian calendar we use now made a tiny tweak to it to reduce drift, but is nearly the same.
I don’t remember specifically where I got the idea, but when I was in the military, we used it for operations and never used the month. We would solely state the day of the year. If that has another name, then that’s what I’m talking about. A yearly calendar where the date is the day of the year in sequential order without months.
I think you’re talking about this, which the article says used to called Julian date
The Julian calendar is the one that has no special rule for leap years. It is currently October the 12th in the Julian calendar.
The calendar that is used all around the world is the Gregorian calendar.
What you mean is called the ordinal date (at least by Wikipedia: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Julian_calendar, see the disambiguation note at the top)
He means Julian day number. It’s unrelated to the historic calendar
I’m SO glad that in my country the 24H format is the de facto standard! There are very few things I like in this shithole, but the ISO-8601 dates and the 24H time format is definitely one of them.
You forgot decimal time!
We should stop this nonsense of having 24 hours a day, 60 minutes per hours, 60 seconds per minutes, 1000 ms per seconds.
Instead we switch to switch to decimal time: 10 hours a day, 100 minutes per hours and 100 second per minutes.
12 divides nicer and evener than 10. If only evolution had given us two extra fingers we’d use base twelve numbers and everything would be better.
Some cultures do/did count to 12 on their fingers using their thumb as a pointer and counting the spaces between their knuckles. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Duodecimal#Origin
Yes! All this plus International Fixed Calendar and then all date issues will be solved forever!
Or until we start going to space for real
Or just switch to using base 12
Why not a base 16 then ?
12 is a superior highly composite number, which means it’s easier to divide without running into fractions or decimals.
Interesting, I did not knew the concept
That would require redefining the second or no longer linking the day with the rotation of the Earth.
I like how your suggestions successively became more radical.
But, Julian calendar? Still a rookie I see.
The calendar year has 13 months with 28 days each, divided into exactly 4 weeks (13 × 28 = 364). An extra day added as a holiday at the end of the year (after December 28, i.e. equal December 31 Gregorian), sometimes called “Year Day”, does not belong to any week and brings the total to 365 days.
I suspect about 1% of the world cares enough to even have this discussion though.
I hope you’ve gotten your Kurzgesagt calendar like I have!
Killing DST and establishing metric in the USA is the one selfish thing I’d like to see Biden do before leaving office permanently.
we need to change over to the Julian calendar
That’s where the names of the months of the Gregorian calendar (which is what we’re using) come from, the Julian calender got them from the old Roman calendar (which was inaccurate as fuck). The main relevant change in the Gregorian reform is the spacing of leap years, making it drift less than the Julian one. It’s still drifting a bit and a fix was proposed back in the 19th century but never adopted. We’ll probably revisit the topic in the decade before the year 4000 where it’s actually going to matter.
If you want a sane calendar try the Discordian one. Though arguably St. Tib’s day shouldn’t be right in the middle of a season. I’d suggest considering it the 0th day of Chaos, giving an additional hangover day for New Year’s every once in a while, also, set the St. Tib’s day years to the same stuff as the aforementioned reformed Gregorian, whith an asterisks saying “change as needed once the earth starts falling into the sun for real”. The starting year (1 YOLD is 1166 BC) is fine because it’s completely random.
Me texting my friends…
Me: What are you doing for Conflufux?
Friend: What is that?
Me: Bro, Confusion 50
Friend: I don’t know what you’re talking about.
Me: Typical
I propose everything be based on factors of 10 - 10 hours per day, 100 or 1000 days per year, etc. None of this ‘basing time and calendar off of easily and widely recognizable natural phenomenon!’
I support a move to 24 hour time. I’m sick of waking up from a nap checking the clock to see if I overslept, and it’s like “It’s 5.” 5 what? Did I sleep 1 hour or 13?
Can’t check the sun. I live in the north. The sun lies.
Why don’t you just set your clock to 24h? I’ve never had a digital clock without that option
Some of my clocks have the option, some don’t. I find it inconvenient to have different clocks set to different things making my brain have to mentally convert between eachother. Not to mention having to mentally convert the time every time I need to give a time to somebody else. It’d just be easier if the whole world was on 24 hour by default.
In most of the world, 24h is the default. Though being able to convert is still necessary, since analog clocks still exist. It really isn’t too difficult to get used to.
I like it! Meanwhile, the US still hasn’t managed to convert to the metric system. Imagine the confusion if the rest of the world decided to adopt this time system and we didn’t. Oh god
The US converted the only part of its economy and culture that matters to metric, and that’s it’s military!
Right now at the time of this edit, it is 5:00 pm on October 25, 2023 EST (daylights savings time), or better yet, 12023-298-2100
I support going over to stardates. Anyway we’ll need to do this once we leave Earth so we might as well get used to it now.
Implying we’d ever get off this planet before wiping ourselves out. :/
I support your support
Why would we still be counting Earth years when we leave Earth?
I am 1010% on board with this and will be using no other system going forward
I’m onboard with first moving to this, and then decimal time, aka metric time.
in all seriousness, I’m a big fan of metric time. change it so there are 100,000 seconds in a day (currently the figure is 86400) - the duration of a second would only be 864/1000 of present. a minute can be 100 seconds, which would be equivalent to 86.4 seconds now, and there could be 50 minutes in an hour (4320 current seconds, compared to 3600, or 72 minutes) and 20 hours in a day.
it would be a bit of a shift, but I don’t think it would need impossible, and just think of the advantages.
no, really, please think of some advantages. I’m drawing a blank.
I apologise as I too am drawing a blank, but apparently it’ll be more conducive to time zone removal according to ChatGPT.
Also metric time gives 10 hours of 100 minutes each in a day, not 20 hours of 50 minutes.
that’s another option, but we’re used to having 12-16 hours of daylight, having that fall to 5-6 would be a much bigger shock than 10-12.
not to mention having every hour last the equivalent of 144 current minutes would make the hours really drag on.
Yeah, but so will the ordinal date calendar with no months, and the shorter seconds but longer minutes. I don’t think the discomfort is an argument that’s entirely valid here, the transition of course shouldn’t be abrupt but the end goal should be the ideal version, that we should aim for and not the midway steps.
if you look at the julian calendar what will you see? months. I don’t think you know enough about the julian calendar to say that we should switch to it
I’m with you on most things.
Two counter points though
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a normal date is already 14 characters: 2023-10-25-2100
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while I dislike the religious connection of the year numbering, I actually don’t care about it. And adding ten thousand to it doesn’t change anything. It’s like putting a spoiler on a slow car and then pretending it’s better now. No it isn’t you are just expressing your desire for something better in a shitty way that is actually worse. Seriously, adding a 1 to the year is a useless change.
If you desperately want to change year zero, there apparently exists the Julian period and Julian day number:
The Julian day number (JDN) is the integer assigned to a whole solar day in the Julian day count starting from noon Universal Time, with Julian day number 0 assigned to the day starting at noon on Monday, January 1, 4713 BC, proleptic Julian calendar (November 24, 4714 BC, in the proleptic Gregorian calendar), a date at which three multi-year cycles started (which are: Indiction, Solar, and Lunar cycles) and which preceded any dates in recorded history. For example, the Julian day number for the day starting at 12:00 UT (noon) on January 1, 2000, was 2451545.
Your “normal date” is ambiguous - which time zone?
Op forgot a few characters to ensure proper iso date and time format:
20231025T210000Z
I’m in favor of global UTC as well, so the same as your example date.
The point was more in comparison to the 31 character claim, which is not a fair comparison when you spell out the name of the month.
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The most amount of effort for the least return of actually helping human beings.
And that’s just your post itself, so far.
Can I ask what you think the Julian calendar is?
What the hell are months even?? They don’t serve any purpose other than
They used to be used to note the change of the weather from one season to another, in a general range (not a literal single solstice date) sort of way.
However it does seem like the seasons are slipping in comparison to the calendar, Summer starting later and ending later, etc.
International travel would be way more confusing.
If I land somewhere at 9am local time I know that the bank will be open when I land and it will be day time.
If everyone is on the same time and I travel somewhere it will be a complete surprise (or I will have to figure it out before hand) whether or not it will be the middle of the night or the middle of the day.
But who cares? Everything would be open 8am-5pm GMT regardless if it’s sunny or dark outside. Go visit the Grand Canyon at midnight, it’s the same as at sunrise or at noon!
No it wouldn’t, generally it’s healthier for humans to sleep at night, so businesses are going to trend towards operating during sunlight hours.
One☝🏿humanity. One☝🏾period in the day inconsiderate of the meridian. One☝🏽variable for the date in a year. One☝🏼love. One☝🏻time.
Children will be blessed for
Killing Of Educated Adults
Who Ignore 4 Simultaneous
Days Same Earth Rotation.
Practicing Evil ONEness -
Upon Earth Of Quadrants.
Evil Adult Crime VS Youth.
Supports Lie Of Integration.
1 Educated Are Most Dumb.
Not 1 Human Except Dead 1.
Man Is Paired, 2 Half 4 Self.
I have no idea what you’re talking about, but I like it.
It’s apparently a reference to this “”theory””
yo, that shit is hilarious!! 😆
I kept trying to disagree but I couldn’t. It’ll suck but it’ll be worth it. We should metricate the English speaking world while we do it. And no the uk has not metricated, they just pretend to have
You must appreciate China, they’re all on one time zone.
I’ve been using 24 hour UTC for a few days and one big problem I’ve noticed is days of ðe week. Where I live, days end in ðe afternoon (around 1800 local time) so I get confused about what day of ðe week it is in ðe evening.
It’s all well and good, but can you add to the list the US just fucking changing to SI units instead of the stupid ass English system? (Since we’re on the topic of the things that will never happen.)
I’d go farther and make sure everyone works 365 days a year, 0800-0500 GMT daily. No exceptions!!!
The vast majority of people want it to change, but we can’t get organized enough to politically make it happen.
You can change the word “it” above to apply to a LOT of things.
It’s really not worth the hassle tho…
Like, back when we had oil lamps and even when we first had electricity…
Sure, why not do it?
But now benefits are negligible, and the downsides like skyrocketing rates of early morning heart attacks are very real.
There’s just no good reason to do it, and lots of reasons not to
I heard somewhere (shit source I know, but I’m at work so not looking it up) that one of the main proponents of daylight savings is golf courses (and restaurants). They get more tee times in with more daylight. And since everyone that rules the world golfs for some damn reason, I don’t see it changing soon.
it was never worth the hassle because its not for your benefit its for the benefit of your boss , you waking up earlier in winter gives your boss one extra hour of work from you in daylight
I thought this was for farmers back when they were their own boss?
I grew up on a farm. We started before it was daylight, didn’t matter what time was on the clock.
Why would the time on a clock matter to a self-employed farmer?
When I asked that question once I was informed it had something to do for some reason with when the children of farmers would be let out of school (and thus able to help with chores) but honestly it sounds like bullshit to me.
We’d have people miss whole weeks of school due to farming duties…
Especially earlier than that, school always took a second seat. If there was work to be done, the kids weren’t in school
https://www.historic-uk.com/CultureUK/British-Summer-Time/
In the UK it was brought in during the first world war as a method partly to save coal. Never had anything to do with farmers, but seems to have become a convenient explanation for it these days.
This is unreasonable. Just change the earth’s tilt on its axis. The other solution will only lead to confusion.
Yeah just give it another spin so it stops wobbling.
Shorter days, I like it
I want to set my clock back every time. Let’s just do that.
After 12 years you’d have gained an entire day! If that’s not saving daylight i don’t know what is.
If you like adjusting the clock why not do it every day
Not that I’ll ever be in a position to have employees, but if somehow I ever find myself in that situation, the start of the work day will be set at 2 hours after sunrise.
Amen to that!
Winter = 5 hour workdays
Thank you dropping by HR today, Mr. Penguin!
As we said in the email, you can see here in the fine print that no leaving hours were specified, and we MOST CERTAINLY never implied that your working hours would be restricted by daylight.
As such, we expect you to only leave your cubicle when dawn breaks, which, very generously, should be more than sufficient to cover your day to day needs before resuming work.
Where do you live? I live pretty far up and I get 6 hours of daylight in December.
Hey can I work for you?
It depends on the industry but if the work is not time sensitive, I’d tell employees to start whenever, and finish 8 hours (or the appropriate shift length for the type of work) after that. I’d plot the average start and end times in a chart and I’d schedule any required team meetings to catch the largest overlap of employees (within reason, aiming to keep that overlap between 8am-6pm, unless we’re all somehow on night shift)
I have a circadian rhythm disorder and shift start and end times not lining up with my natural sleep pattern is honestly the worst part of working. There’s got to be a better way to do it. Humans aren’t designed to start and stop work based on a clock, but some of us also don’t work with the sun.
I’d much rather change my clock to daylight savings time and then never change it again.
We had a vote but it was essentially deliberately ruined from the get go. Instead of yes or no, it was permanent summer time, permanent winter time, or keep daylight savings so the people wanting permanent time split their vote and lost.
Who are the chucklefucks that want it to get dark at 4:30PM for half the year?
Plenty of people would prefer the extra daylight in the mornings rather than the evenings. I’m personally in favour of summer time all the time
And I personally don’t give a shit, just please stop fucking with the clock.
Let’s have a vote, simple majority wins, done.
Chronobiologists. The people who actually study how time impacts our well being and health.
The American public. Permanent DST was tried once already and winter with DST is way worse than summer with standard time.
Everyone who hates how early they have to get up for work. Standard time lets you sleep longer. (It’s hard to think about, but it’s true!)
This is the crux of the issue. An overwhelming majority of people support not changing the clocks anymore. But we can’t reach a consensus on which to stick with. Personally, I think Arizona did it right.
And it’s nice to know that the sun is actually at its highest at noon and its lowest at midnight. Seems weird to me to decide that 13:00 is when the sun is highest…
deleted by creator
“Abortions for some, tiny american flags for others!”
Most of my clocks go through the change themselves. My wristwatch is a bit trickier sometimes (radio waves).
Would be less of a hassle to have one time 👍
I have seen a proposal where everyone just uses Greenwich time and then just accepts that their day begins at 2:00 p.m. or whatever. That way 2:00 p.m. is the same time everywhere on the planet, for some people that’s night, for some people thats day, for some people that’s the middle of the day.
But can we first make a day everywhere 24h instead of 2x 12h?
Let’s jump straight to decimal time then.
1h23m45s is 1 decimal hour, 23 decimal minutes, and 45 decimal seconds, or 1.2345 decimal hours, or 123.45 decimal minutes or 12345 decimal seconds; 3 hours is 300 minutes or 30,000 seconds. This property also makes it straightforward to represent a timestamp as a fractional day, so that 2023-10-26.54321 can be interpreted as five decimal hours and 43 decimal minutes and 21 decimal seconds after the start of that day, or a fraction of 0.54321 (54.321%) through that day (which is shortly after traditional 13:00)
That’s a language problem, in a lot of European languages they already work like that.
In French the way they say 9:20 a.m. is literally “the time of 9 hours 20 minutes” and 3:45 p.m. is “the time of 15 hours 45 minutes”. It’s written as “h1545”. Which is very close to how military time works in English speaking countries.
That causes problems with culture/language/communication.
Like the saying “from 9 to 5” could not be applied to other timezones anymore. Or when reading direct speech in a book, “Let’s meet at 15:00”, you wouldn’t be able to tell anymore what time of the day that means.
Since both approaches have pros and cons, I think we would need overwhelmingly good arguments to justify a change.
Lol, that’s the worst idea ever. I doubt anyone would follow it.
Humans are still beholden to our biology, circadian rhythms and all.
You do understand that the way we measure time is totally arbitrary… right?
Nothing in that proposal violates your objection, though.
They’re not saying that people would abandon their daily schedule in favor of one that matched the schedule at GMT. Rather, the number attached to the local time would simply change to match.
It’d be utterly bizarre at first, since there’d be no understood "wake up at 6 to 8am, work through the rest of the am hours into the mid pm hours, head home at 4 or 5pm, etc ", but it seems like once you adjusted to it in your area, it would work.
For example, in my area, I’d be waking up around noon, starting work in the early afternoon, through the pm hours, finishing up around 9pm and coming home to have dinner around 11pm or 12am, and heading to bed in the early am hours. I’d still be waking up in the morning, working through the normal office hours of the day, returning home in the late afternoon, having dinner in the evening and going to bed a few hours later, at night…it’s just that the numbers on the clock assigned to those times of day would be different.
This proposal isn’t that you wake up at 7:00am Greenwich time regardless of where you are on the planet, though. The proposal is that you wake up at sunrise (or whatever), which might be at 19:00 Greenwich time, and everybody just has an absolute measure of time that’s the same everywhere, abolishing timezones (potentially making it easier to schedule a meeting across timezones).
I’m not necessarily in favour of this plan, I think I’d be fine with it, but I think timezones are a somewhat useful abstraction. The one thing that always bothers me related to this, though, is the argument about whether or not we should have permanent DST or no DST based on whether we should wake up “earlier” or “later” in the sun cycle or whatever… And like… It doesn’t matter. You can call it 6:00am or 7:00am, you’re waking up at the same time. It doesn’t matter if we call the hours that business are open from 9:00-17:00 or 8:00-16:00… When the clocks don’t change the times are just arbitrary names. Ultimately I really don’t care, I just want people to stop fucking with clocks every 6 months… But because the numbers are somewhat arbitrary I think we should settle on no DST because then noon more accurately corresponds to solar noon, which I think makes more sense and would help people be more in tune with the solar cycle.
TIL daylightsaving time is saving lives
We did this in Guatemala one year, the government tried to start using DST and half of the population just ignored them. That was a fun year.
As someone who is near the south pole… I am NOT living in a world where it starts to get sunny at 5:20am
That sounds like a “you problem”
I live in a normal place and 5:20am is a regular time for the sun to rise.
And it does not start to get sunny the day after.
Wait a second, south Poland?Whoa. Didn’t know anyone from there uses lemmy. What’s next? ISS?
I see. Last man with his job in tact wins the debate!
I was pro abolition of DST until I got Solar PV, now I like it again because it matches generation to usage better.
fuck that noise, get batteries and don’t fuck with our sleep schedules
Wait, when is Bonus Beer Night this year?
