A British citizen is among dozens of festival attendees who are missing, kidnapped or presumed dead

The Israeli rescue service Zaka says its paramedics removed more than 260 bodies from a music festival that came under attack by Hamas militants.

The total figure of bodies found is expected to be higher, as other paramedic teams were also working in the area and Zaka added that the bodies “haven’t all been collected yet”.

Early on Saturday morning, Hamas targeted Nova music festival, a techno rave in the desert near the border with Gaza.

Videos shared on social media and by Israeli news outlets showed dozens of festival-goers running through an open field as gunshots rang out. Many hid in nearby fruit orchards or were gunned down as they fled.

  • nbafantest@lemmy.worldEnglish
    4621·
    1 year ago

    There’s a lot of commenting from westerners about this, but it’s not going to matter. Israel is going to wipe out Hamas. Hopefully the regular Palestinians survive with out much damage. And in the future they have a better life.

    But it is very clear the people of Israel are very united in what they’re need to do and how to do it.

    • vivadanang@lemm.eeEnglish
      265·
      1 year ago

      Israel is going to wipe out Hamas.

      Honest question: to Israelis that want to see this, what does this mean? forcing the Palestinians out completely to Jordan and Lebanon?

      don’t get me wrong, it’d be awesome if you could just magically zap the terrorists, but that’s not reality. so what’s the end game with this kind of rhetoric?

      • Landmammals@lemmy.worldEnglish
        101·
        1 year ago

        Correct me if I’m wrong but isn’t Hamas the political body that is in control of the Gaza strip?

        They sent a military force to go kill civilians. I don’t know how much of Israel’s motivation is to take the Gaza strip back and move Palestinian civilians around, but killing that many civilians has definitely put Hamas into “fuck around and find out” territory. At the very least I would expect that Israel will not stop until Hamas is no longer a political entity in Gaza.

      • Ð Greıt Þu̇mpkin@lemm.eeEnglish
        3·
        1 year ago

        Nuremberg scenario if we’re lucky.

        It turned Germany from antisemitism central into Europe’s strongest economy and democracy, at least up until the AfD started trying to weasel the nazi shit back in.

        Problem is this isn’t the allies making the call here, it’s Israel, who’s a lot more interested in just crippling Gaza industrially and militarily to the point that rocket assembly and launching become an impossibility, so either absolutely flattening the place, or permanently occupying the place until Fatah or another faction that’s not as batshit insane as Hamas are able to pretend to be in control while basically being a paper government where Israel’s “security concerns” clash with Gaza’s sovereignty.

        • vivadanang@lemm.eeEnglish
          2·
          1 year ago

          Yeah, Hamas basically destroyed themselves with this shit. The rest of the world watched their warcriming and said “You know, perhaps these aren’t the folks that peace can be reached with, go nuts Israel, bomb the shit out of them.”

          Who’s gonna stand up for Hamas at this point, russia and iran? pfft… get fucked. Any plausible case for their victimhood got lost when they went down this road.

    • Rotten_potato@lemmy.worldEnglish
      213·
      1 year ago

      So far the Israeli government under Netanyahu has mostly done things to strengthen Hamas, a more radical and violent (but controlled by the vastly stronger Israeli military, or so they thought) group in power in Gaza was deemed beneficial since it prevents the formation of “reasonable”, anti-violent advocates for Palestinian liberation. Didn’t really work out that well I guess.

        • TheSanSabaSongbird@lemdro.idEnglish
          3·
          1 year ago

          That remains to be seen. In situations like this people tend to either double down on, or turn against their leaders. I think the dust needs to settle a little more before we know which way the wind is blowing for Netanyahu. My hunch is that you are probably right, at least in the short-term.

    • kent_eh@lemmy.caEnglish
      161·
      1 year ago

      Hopefully the regular Palestinians survive with out much damage.

      Based on the last 50+ years of history of conflict between these 2, I can’t be optimistic that your hopes will come true.

    • dangblingus@lemmy.dbzer0.comEnglish
      3421·
      1 year ago

      I expect to see reports of wholesale slaughter of Palestinian civilians. You know, normal every day stuff for the IDF.

      • astral_avocado@lemm.eeEnglish
        153·
        1 year ago

        I’ve read Hamas specifically runs military operations in civilian buildings like hospitals as a meat shield, is that not true?

        • nednobbins@lemm.eeEnglish
          82·
          1 year ago

          This is a claim regularly made by the IDF. It seems fairly likely and I haven’t seen any evidence to the contrary.

          I’m not sure how different that is from deliberately putting civilian settlements in a hotly contested buffer zone though.

          • hassanmckusick@lemmy.discothe.questEnglish
            26·
            1 year ago

            Bro you are cracked.

            This is a claim regularly made by the IDF. It seems fairly likely and I haven’t seen any evidence to the contrary.

            “I have 0 evidence in either direction but the propaganda I like tells me X”

            How are people who are getting bombed supposed to provide you evidence to the contrary? Why is it not on the State of Israel to prove that their targets have military personnel inside before they kill the civilians?

            Take away the fact that Israel routinely bombs news buildings, ya know the buildings with the cameras and networks capable of providing evidence, what kind of evidence could they even provide that would make you say “no I’m wrong”?

            Lets say the people in AP building ran around and took pictures before the bombing and showed no one in Hamas gear before the bombing, people would just shift the goalposts and say “well they could take off their military gear and hide as civilians”, “oh those pictures could be fake”, “how do we know they were even taken at the right time?”

            As soon as you’ve accepted the premise that Israel can kill civilians first and ask questions later you’ve lost the plot.

            • nednobbins@lemm.eeEnglish
              4·
              1 year ago

              I don’t think you finished reading my comment in the first place but I’ll expand on it.

              Terrorists/freedom fighters/insurgents (whatever you want to call them) regularly have their operations in civilian buildings; the IRA did it, the country formerly known as the 13 colonies did it, Boxers did it, ETA did it… It’s just standard MO because they have no choice.

              • hassanmckusick@lemmy.discothe.questEnglish
                12·
                1 year ago

                I don’t think you finished reading my comment in the first place but I’ll expand on it.

                I did I just snapped because I think it’s stupid to excuse war crimes without evidence. It has probably happened in the past, it will probably happen in the future but to take Israels word unconditionally is giving Israel a blank check to commit war crimes. Israel gets $3.8 billion a year from the US, they should not be launching a single missile until they have evidence there is at least one member of the opposing side (or their equipment) where it’s gonna land.

                Coming back today, yeah I appreciate the latter half of your first comment and the entirety of this one.

    • nednobbins@lemm.eeEnglish
      61·
      1 year ago

      The reports I’ve read claim that around 1,000 Hamas terrorist entered Israel. The IDF claims to have recovered the bodies of about 1,500 terrorists inside Israel. Given that this is an active conflict, it’s not surprising that the numbers don’t line up but they’re of the same order of magnitude.

      Since Hamas has hostages it’s clear that at least some of those terrorists made it back to Gaza. It’s also clear that the IDF has, by now, killed the vast majority of the terrorists who carried out these acts.

      So who is currently being targeted by IDF ordinance?

      • Ð Greıt Þu̇mpkin@lemm.eeEnglish
        1·
        1 year ago

        My guess is the operation being carried out is to close the border with Egypt to establish full access control in and out of Gaza. Any other ops being carried out will either be hostage rescue, targeted attempts at black bagging participants and leaders of the attacks, or causing general mayhem to keep Hamas from being able to coordinate with itself for long enough to mount a counteroperation.

        The end goal will be twofold, 1) gain customs control over all points of entry to the strip to neuter Hamas’ ability to keep importing rockets and the parts to make their own, 2) sweep the strip for the leaders of the attack for as public and humiliating a comupence as can be legally dropped on them, and probably beyond that too. This attack put a serious black eye on Israel’s hawks claiming they’re the faction for tighter security that will keep the Israeli people safe, Bibi is probably seeing enough red that it’s a sign of officials intervening against his worst reflexes that we’re not witnessing a Srebenica scenario in Gaza right now.

        • nednobbins@lemm.eeEnglish
          1·
          1 year ago

          They may move to tactics like that eventually but for now it’s artillery and airstrikes. Netanyahu threatened to bomb Gaza to rubble and it looks like he’s carrying that out.

          I don’t see anything targeted about the current retaliation; what we’re hearing and seeing now is most consistent with a scorched earth policy.

    • TheBlue22@lemmy.blahaj.zoneEnglish
      1213·
      1 year ago

      I don’t think they want to wipe them out. The government of izrael needs Hamas for their own selfish reasons. Without a proper enemy, a proper “them”, such a fascist government like Izrael cannot exist

      • nbafantest@lemmy.worldEnglish
        64·
        1 year ago

        I don’t think the Israeli voters are going to find that acceptable. One of the good things about democracy.

        But we will see.