It doesn’t matter, even a fully actualized public owned economy still requires that it estimate and compare production and capital increase so it knows 1. How much to alot for each citizen in the daily/weekly/monthly UBI, and 2. How to compare its production capacity and volume of capital to other countries who may or may not also be collectivist.
Both of these needs require the exact understanding of production increase so that it can accurately estimate the capital (capital in this sense being the amount of wealth set aside specifically for the increase in production capacity/efficiency) that allows the economy to grow. Thus they can take that information and increase the amount of dollars available to the country or it’s citizens for use or trade with other nations.
Dictators and authoritarianism get you killed. Some capitalist countries have also have these things and, oddly enough, people also die for the same reasons. Could it be… the economic model actually isn’t the issue?
Ahhh, the old “I know nothing about what I’m talking about so I’m going to keep making things up” defense. Classic move and stunningly performed. I can tell you have practice.
The classic: I’m not going to disprove you because I cannot name one communist country that isn’t a dictatorship, but I want to sound cool nonetheless. Well done.
How’s the Che Guevara t-shirt made in a sweatshop doing?
The problem is systemic and you’re just looking at the symptoms not the disease.
Lawmakers (politcians in power) and lawenforcers (judges, regulators, police) become corrupt in a Capitalism system for a simple reason: when the top social message is “Greed is good”, lawmaker and lawenforcers too - just like everybody else - will have as top priority the maximizing of personal upsides, even if only because they too want to “live the good life” that the Media in Capitalist countries is always showing as being lived by others.
So laws are made to benefit those who can make the lawmakers rich and to make it legal for them to get paid in that way, so over time laws and the structures are changed to make corruption de facto be legal (even if only by not being prosecuted).
Similarly in the Justice System you have de facto different criteria depending on the wealth of each side, Justice which is unaffordable for anybody but the rich, arbitrary or non-enforcement of laws and regulations and so on.
It’s ridiculous to expect that in a Society were Greed Is Good, people with lots of power (politicians, members of the Judiciary) will somehow put “service to others” ahead of “personal upside maximization”.
Capitalism naturally tends to become Crony Capitalism over time and only very strong and genuine Democractic structures (with politics, the judiciary and the press being strong and independent pillars of Democracy, and no mathematical rigging of voting systems to put always people from the same 2 groups in power) can delay that tendency, and if you look around to places like the US with its power duopoly, “vote me ´cause I’m not as bad as the other guy” voting theatre and politically nominated top judges, aren’t strong and genuine Democracies.
You shout about “don’t legalize bribery” and yet the systems in place in most Capitalist so-called Democracies make sure the kind of politicians who get power are the ones who make bribery legal and even normal, and that the Judicial System is thoroughly subverted to close its eyes to things any normal person would consider Bribery and Corruption - you will never get your wish because the very system is designed for that never to happen and even if by magic tomorrow every politician and member of the Judicial System were impeccably honest and put “public service” above “personal upside maximization”, Capitalism would over time subvert it, be it because many of those would look around and see others getting benefits from “personal upside maximization” and think “why not me?” whilst lots of dishonest people are attracted to positions of power were they can more easilly increase personal wealth, such as politics or the Judiciary so over time those areas would be wholly riddled with rot, just as they are now.
It’s funny because the whole utopian Communism (a World were everybody is equal) is impossible and always end up in a Dictatorship were some are elite and the rest as plebs, is due to the same human characteristics why “Pure” Capitalism is impossible and will always end up as Crony Capitalism.
So, price fixing doesn’t exist in communism?
Can you price gouge in a moneyless society?
You do realize socialist/communist economies still have a need for money, right?
They were not communist economies by any realistic definition
It doesn’t matter, even a fully actualized public owned economy still requires that it estimate and compare production and capital increase so it knows 1. How much to alot for each citizen in the daily/weekly/monthly UBI, and 2. How to compare its production capacity and volume of capital to other countries who may or may not also be collectivist.
Both of these needs require the exact understanding of production increase so that it can accurately estimate the capital (capital in this sense being the amount of wealth set aside specifically for the increase in production capacity/efficiency) that allows the economy to grow. Thus they can take that information and increase the amount of dollars available to the country or it’s citizens for use or trade with other nations.
Of course. I don’t like you, you don’t get sugar/meat/butter/gasoline/freedom. Price: infinite.
You have no idea what you’re talking about lol.
Da, comrade
Love how everyone’s argument for capitalism is just ‘well communism sucks too’.
Good job regurgitating half a century’s worth of propaganda, no one mentioned communism and there’s more than just 2 ways to run q society
I was born and have lived in a communist country. It doesn’t “suck too”, it gets you killed. Good job regurgitating garbage tired internet arguments.
Dictators and authoritarianism get you killed. Some capitalist countries have also have these things and, oddly enough, people also die for the same reasons. Could it be… the economic model actually isn’t the issue?
Except there are democratic capitalist countries, all communist countries are dictatorships.
Ahhh, the old “I know nothing about what I’m talking about so I’m going to keep making things up” defense. Classic move and stunningly performed. I can tell you have practice.
The classic: I’m not going to disprove you because I cannot name one communist country that isn’t a dictatorship, but I want to sound cool nonetheless. Well done.
How’s the Che Guevara t-shirt made in a sweatshop doing?
How about pragmatism: real solutions to real problems.
Real solutions exist. Step 1: don’t legalize bribery.
The problem is systemic and you’re just looking at the symptoms not the disease.
Lawmakers (politcians in power) and lawenforcers (judges, regulators, police) become corrupt in a Capitalism system for a simple reason: when the top social message is “Greed is good”, lawmaker and lawenforcers too - just like everybody else - will have as top priority the maximizing of personal upsides, even if only because they too want to “live the good life” that the Media in Capitalist countries is always showing as being lived by others.
So laws are made to benefit those who can make the lawmakers rich and to make it legal for them to get paid in that way, so over time laws and the structures are changed to make corruption de facto be legal (even if only by not being prosecuted).
Similarly in the Justice System you have de facto different criteria depending on the wealth of each side, Justice which is unaffordable for anybody but the rich, arbitrary or non-enforcement of laws and regulations and so on.
It’s ridiculous to expect that in a Society were Greed Is Good, people with lots of power (politicians, members of the Judiciary) will somehow put “service to others” ahead of “personal upside maximization”.
Capitalism naturally tends to become Crony Capitalism over time and only very strong and genuine Democractic structures (with politics, the judiciary and the press being strong and independent pillars of Democracy, and no mathematical rigging of voting systems to put always people from the same 2 groups in power) can delay that tendency, and if you look around to places like the US with its power duopoly, “vote me ´cause I’m not as bad as the other guy” voting theatre and politically nominated top judges, aren’t strong and genuine Democracies.
You shout about “don’t legalize bribery” and yet the systems in place in most Capitalist so-called Democracies make sure the kind of politicians who get power are the ones who make bribery legal and even normal, and that the Judicial System is thoroughly subverted to close its eyes to things any normal person would consider Bribery and Corruption - you will never get your wish because the very system is designed for that never to happen and even if by magic tomorrow every politician and member of the Judicial System were impeccably honest and put “public service” above “personal upside maximization”, Capitalism would over time subvert it, be it because many of those would look around and see others getting benefits from “personal upside maximization” and think “why not me?” whilst lots of dishonest people are attracted to positions of power were they can more easilly increase personal wealth, such as politics or the Judiciary so over time those areas would be wholly riddled with rot, just as they are now.
It’s funny because the whole utopian Communism (a World were everybody is equal) is impossible and always end up in a Dictatorship were some are elite and the rest as plebs, is due to the same human characteristics why “Pure” Capitalism is impossible and will always end up as Crony Capitalism.
So if both capitalism and communism are not possible due to greed, what do you suggest? Feudalism? Anarchism?
Capitalism sucks, but everything else sucks even more.
Now you’re getting it!
It doesn’t have anything to do with capitalism, tho. Plenty of countries where lobbying is regulated/forbidden.