Conducting a little bit of an experiment with this discussion… when you hear the term “finesse” (typically in a derogatory manner), which teams from across the decades spring to mind?
Marino’s Dolphins, for sure. Not to say that they didn’t field some tough teams, but they were running when other teams were crawling in the passing game.
Dude dropped 5k and 48 TDs in 1984 with the big boy rules. He had 100 fewer attempts than Peyton had in his record-setting season.
2017-19 rams
The broncos when they got smoked by the Seahawks in the Super Bowl. It doesn’t help they played one of the most physical teams ever. Also just the way manning had to throw looked soft.
That whole Manning offense that year was bullshit crossing routes. They were fucking pick plays. It worked all year until they played a defense where the cornerbacks just fucking held and dared the refs to throw flags. Broncos had zero answers that day.
It worked all year until they played a defense where the cornerbacks just fucking held and dared the refs to throw flags.
That Super Bowl was a matchup of a Broncos offense that committed illegal offensive pass interference every play and a Seahawks defense that committed just about every penalty they thought they could get away with.
What most people forget (or didn’t even see) was that in the AFC Championship Game 2 weeks prior to that Super Bowl, Welker went and fucking speared Aqib Talib and knocked him out of the game on an illegal pick, no flag. Broncos were the healthier team going into that game anyway and would have won anyway, but for the Pats to lose their best and most physical corner to a cheap shot with no flag early essentially sealed the victory before halftime. Watching the Seahawks beat the shit out of the Broncos was cathartic after watching Denver get away with that garbage all year to set records.
I mean I know I’ll sound like a homer but they didn’t always hold. They played within the rules. The NFL DID change and tighten those rules right after, by the way. But the LOB were still amazing then too.
To say a defense with Richard Sherman, Earl Thomas, Kam Chancellor, Bobby Wagner, KJ Wright, Cliff Avril, Michael Bennett, Chris Clemons, Red Bryant, Brandon, Brandon Browner etc won that game because they held is silly. It was an unbelievably, insanely stacked defense. The only defensive starter who wasn’t pro bowl caliber at the very least was SB MVP Malcolm Smith.
I did some football tourism that year and saw a Seahawks game in Seattle as a neutral fan. That defense was unbelievable. I didn’t mean to imply that they only won because they fouled all day. They certainly had the talent on defense to execute. But you’re not going to hold up with slow cornerbacks against pick plays unless you move to a zone, which Manning would eat up. So they played man and held. It worked great.
Damn, I forgot just how stacked that defense was. Everyone talks about the secondary, but all three levels were about as good as I’ve ever seen.
Well you better shield your eyes, because I feel the same way about the 2017 Jags defense.
Campbell, Jackson, Ngakoue, and Fowler on the line. Smith, Jack, and Pos at linebacker. Ramsey, Bouye, Church, and Gipson in the secondary. Pro-Bowlers and All-Pros at every level.
1990s Buffalo Bills
Marino dolphins maybe?
I think of the 2002 Bucs (in a good way.) They were a smallish defense that relied on speed and smarts to beat opposing offenses, and they were great at it. But if the Raiders had chosen to run the ball down their throats in the Super Bowl (instead of Gannon passing it all over the place,) they’d have been steamrolled.
2019 ravens
The offense was not a finesse offense. It was literally the greatest rushing offense of all time and our OL was dominant.
The defense however was the definition of a finesse defense. They covered very well but they lived off of turnovers, all our pressure came from blitzes and our run D was soft as bread pudding. Nobody ever tested it until the playoffs bc the offense always jumped ahead to such giant leads.
True but didn’t the titans defense hold the ravens offense off for most of their he game until the ravens scored 2 tds in the 4th quarter.
98 Vikings with Moss, Carter and Robert Smith
Greatest show on turf, 2000s colts, 2010s saints, 2020s bengals
That era Saints feasted on screen passes, which could be argued to be the definition of finesse.
Why do you say 2020’s bengals? Interested to hear your take on it.
Because they are a finesse team. So much of the offense is predicated on timing routes and coordination between Burrow and his receivers. All the back shoulders he throws are a perfect example of a finesse game. They also struggle mightily when played by a more physical defense as we’ve seen against the Ravens the past 2 years.
I remember hearing that a lot about the late '80s/early '90s Niners. Even though it wasn’t really true.
Rams “greatest show on turf” era
Colts at peak Peyton Manning era
Current Chiefs under Mahomes
Raiders that got blasted by Bucs in Super Bowl
Have you seen Pacheco run?
A few years ago we were much more finesse, so I’ll 1/2 agree
100% agree with the Chiefs. They are getting a little more balance recently, but the first 4 years of Mahomes was finesse in my opinion
Rams under Dick Vermeil and Kurt Warner.
Air coryell chargers
Fouts Chargers
Marino Dolphins
What is even ‘finesse’?
I heard this lots about 90s teams throughout all sports including the Los Angeles Kings.
Finesse typically refers to a team that isn’t strong or physical but fast and quick, which is why it’s looked down on in football: smack them in the mouth and they fold like a house of cards.