I currently have a 10-year old off-the-shelf NAS (Synology) that needs replacing soon. I haven’t done much with it other than the simple things I mention later, so I still consider myself a novice when it comes to NAS, servers, and networking in general, but I’ve been reading a bit lately (which lead my to this sub). For a replacement I’m wondering whether to get another Synology, use an open source NAS/server OS, or just use a Windows PC. Windows is by far the OS I’m most comfortable with so I’m drawn to the final option. However, I regularly see articles and forum posts which frown upon the use Windows for NAS/server purposes even for simple home-use needs, although I can’t remember reading a good explanation of why. I’d be grateful for some explanations as to why Windows (desktop version) is a poor choice as an OS for a simple home NAS/server.
Some observations from me (please critique if any issues in my thinking):
- I initially assumed it was because Windows likely causes a high idle power consumption as its a large OS. But I recently measured the idle power consumption of a celeron-based mini PC running Windows and found it to be only 5W, which is lower than my Synology NAS when idle. It seems to me that any further power consumption savings that might be achieved by a smaller OS, or a more modern Synology, would be pretty negligible in terms of running costs.
- I can see a significant downside of Windows for DIY builds is the cost of Windows license. I wonder is this accounts for most of the critique of Windows? If I went the Windows route I wouldn’t do a DIY build. I would start with a PC which had a Windows OEM licence.
- My needs are very simple (although I think probably represent a majority of home user needs). I need device which is accessible 24/7 on my home network and 1) can provide SMB files shares, 2) act as a target for backing up other devices on home network, 3) run cloud backup software (to back itself up to an off-site backup location) and, 4) run a media server (such as Plex), 5) provide 1-drive redundancy via RAID or a RAID-like solution (such as Windows Storage Spaces). It seems to me Windows is fine for this and people who frown upon Windows for NAS/server usage probably have more advanced needs.
For me, #1 is license costs. I’ve taken home some servers which would require me to buy 4+ windows server licenses because 16 physical cores is a number for entry-level servers at this point. For the cost of those licenses, I could almost buy a new server with a similar amount of cores every single year.
Second, the brand new filesystem, ReFS, (which needs licenses), has just about caught up to what ZFS had in 2005. The biggest omission is that 2005 ZFS could be your root filesystem. This is less important on *nix systems where your root can be tiny, but windows insists on storing tons of stuff on C, which still needs to be NTFS. ZFS also has 22 years of production testing and still has lots of development.
Third, I want to use containers, and windows uses a Linux VM to do that, so why not skip the middle man?
Never been a better time to try Linux. Ubuntu is pretty easy to get started with (download and setup a bootable USB, stick it and go) and ChatGPT is extremely good about walking you through any questions. You don’t even need to ask highly technical questions, just tell it your goal and your system.
“I just installed Ubuntu 22.04 on my computer and want to SSH into it from a Windows computer on my network, how do I do that?”
“I want to download a file from my Ubuntu command line, how do I do that?”
“I want to setup a share that both Windows and Linux computers can access over my network, how do I do that?”
“I have a github action runner provided by github that includes a run.sh file that needs to run constantly. I want to setup as a background service on my Ubuntu Linux computer so it will always be running as long as the computer is on, how can I do that?”
It will spit out every command line you need in what order, contents of a .service file, tell you how to monitor it, and so on. You can ask it what each line does, what the parameters mean, etc. It’s like having a mid-level sys admin at your fingertips. It will interpret any errors you get, and tell you how to fix them.
Perfect? Maybe not, but its close for a remarkable variety of tasks. It may be, and I’m not joking, 20 times more productive and time efficient than Google searches, reading stackoverflow posts, reading documentations/man pages and trying to decipher what you really need out of any of those sources.
I’m sure some are too paranoid to ask ChatGPT certain things for privacy reasons, and I would anonymize anything you paste in, probably just be a bit mindful of anything involving permissions (you can also ask what security risks exist doing something). Just normal ChatGP3.5 (free) is extremely knowledgeable about Linux CLI and administration along with common packages and apps you’d want to use.
For server:
docker is linux in a jailed namespace (network, filesystem, process tree, etc jail)
Docker hosted on linux is efficient.
Docket hosted on anything else less so.I use windows 10 pro for my nas/media server. I run drivepool and it works great for me. I run a Pentium gold g6400 and it’s more than enough power. It might use a bit more RAM, but I’ll buy another 8gb of RAM before I spend eons trying to learn how to do something in Linux.
Thanks. hadn’t heard of drivepool. I’ll look into but could you mention key reasons you use this instead of the built-in storage spaces feature?
I used to use Stablebit Drivepool until I migrated to unRAID.
Drivepool is great. You can easily use mismatched drives and you can have folder level duplication (I.E. set files to duplicate to individual folder). If the Drivepool becomes unreadable for whatever reason, you can just mount in and read the drive from almost any operating system. You can also combine it with Stablebit’s DriveScanner and CloudDrive. The scanner will monitor the drives and begin to move data off automatically if the drive reports errors. The clouddrive lets you use cloud providers (such as Google Drive and Onedrive) as normal “hard drives” in your computer. You combine DrivePool and Clouddrive to combine online storage providers to create a single large drive.
Given that you’re “most comfortable” with windows is probably the number one reason why you should go with something other than Windows. I think you should always get out of your comfort zone and expand your knowledge. Sure you can keep using windows but why but branch out! Hell if you really want to take a leap of faith load up TrueNAS core 🤣
End User Windows has a shit history with forcing updates on you and reboots just because you waited to long.
End User Windows is also not great at managing large numbers of storage drives.
They also aren’t great to manage remotely.
RAM management is terrible and I just ran Windows Updates on my gaming PC last night and it went into a boot loop. Been a while since I’ve heard about a NIX platform running into boot loops on system updates.
If you run only system resources, or task manager, or whatever windows is calling their resource manager these days to monitor CPU, right next to a headless debian server running only htop you will straight up see the answer to your question.
That, is overhead.
Short answer: desktop versions are tuned for application performance, especially foreground vs. background, while server versions are tuned for, well, being used as a server, multitasking being less performance-penalizing for background applications (like server daemons/servelets) and of course greater uptime.
There’s also much more bloat on the desktop side, as it’s targeting consumers and not IT.
Windows has more overhead, is more expensive, is less interesting/fun IMO, has poor data parity features, and has less of the homelab community’s attention than any purpose built Linux based home-lab OS. But it will definitely do the job with minimum effort from you.
Honestly, you do you. Stick to what works with your workflow and use case.
However, given that you’re in r/homelab, it’s reasonable to think you’re open to learning new things. With that, Windows tended to not be as stable as Linux (hence the dominance of Linux in the server world).
Windows approach to drivers and software wasn’t as clean as Linux. Uninstalling software was not guaranteed to remove everything in Windows.
Windows license is another minus.
Plus, given that it isn’t open source, and given the dominance in desktop world, lots of viruses tend to target Windows, and we don’t get patches on a timely manner. Plus, there’s a history of patches breaking things in Windows.
Linux and Unix, tends to be simple and stable. Synology is a very good NAS, which combines the robustness of bsd with a fantastic GUI. I’d personally urge you to get another Synology or explore xpenology.
But barring that, your use case today is simple enough and if you think Windows is sufficient, go for it.
If you want to also get learning out of it, explore truenas scale. It’s based on Debian and is fantastic. You can also sideload proxmox on it for various VM and lxc magickery.
Because when you start trying to run actual services, the home-user side of it is going to kick in and make is unreasonably difficult to do simple things such as creating a fileshare, managing permissions, getting your services to work through a firewall, etc. All things which are typically just simple text file configs in Linux, or just a few simple commands.
However if you do persevere and get everything working, it’s not going to last. Windows is going to decide what’s best for you and you will be left trying to figure out what settings were wiped or reverted to default when Windows updated itself without asking.
And then if youre running a server where you want performance, stability, and security, you don’t want extra crap running because all those other services that you absolutely don’t need will start interfering with the services that you do need. Linux VMs or containers on a hypervisor are very popular because you can spin up multiple lightweight instances of the OS to perform a single or limited set of functions. So if something breaks, that breakage doesn’t spill over to the other instances. With Windows, you’d have to spin up a 10GB+ instance each time for this approach because you’d have so much extra stuff you do not need.
I always recommend windows to people who want a home server that’s easy to maintain. Homelabbing is more about learning and trying new things out.
A nuc with a nice size external can do a lot and they come with windows not to mention it can run fine free. A lot of the services people run are all using mono to run the windows app. Anyone who has used Windows can install an exe but not anyone is willing to use command line in Linux.
Home server and self hosted are more focused on what you’re looking for.
You could use windows fine I am sure. It is just the majority of us have other things we like to run and there all developed for Linux or Docker. The other reason people go away from Windows is it uses more RAM and CPU, you are doing so little that it isn’t really that big of an issue for you. If you decide to add anything else or run docker, you will probably see why the majority go with Linux, because you will run into issues.
It’s not so much the Windows is a bad OS for running a NAS but more there are other purposely made OSes for NAS use that have better support for functions that a NAS is expected to runn.