“Who would have declared such a war on us in Moscow?”
After six consecutive days of drone attacks on the Moscow region this week, one would think the shock of sudden late-night explosions might compel some Russians to consider what Ukrainian civilians have endured during 550 days of relentless Russian attacks.
Instead, some residents near the Russian capital have taken to social media to vent about the inconvenience of being woken up in the middle of the night, question why the “international community” isn’t coming to their rescue, and blame Ukrainian “terrorists” for targeting civilian areas. (Never mind that Moscow has repeatedly attacked residential areas in Ukraine with Iranian-made Shahed drones.)
No injuries have been reported in the recent string of attacks, and Russian officials claim to have shot down most of the drones that they say caused only “minor damage” to a building in Moscow City and several broken windows elsewhere. Kyiv has not confirmed or denied involvement in the drone strikes.
Russian media widely covered the attacks, airing interviews with residents who showed off their broken windows.
“It was scary to go up to the window,” said one man recounting his shock to wake up and find his window shattered. “This is the first time anything like this has happened to me.”
Separately, he told Deutsche Welle, “At first, there was panic. I thought the building had been hit by a shell.”
“It’s very scary. What if it hits the house next time?” another resident told DW, noting that she has a young child in the home. “Who would have declared such a war on us in Moscow?” she asked, unironically.
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archive link: https://archive.is/xFkDe
A Soviet Russia joke: A Russian man was accosted by KGB goons and had his expensive watch stolen by them. After the KGB had left, the unfortunate man then cried out loudly, “The Swiss stole my Russian watch!”. A bystander heard this and retorted, “You meant the Russians stole your Swiss watch”. The man then replied, “Yes, but you said it!”
The Muscovites are not stupid. They are merely beaten down so hard and so long that they know to feign ignorance.
“Putin is not stupid, he’s not going to invade”
“Prigozhin is not stupid, he got a good deal”If russians living in the EU can support russia, you bet your ass muskovians living in moscow can be oblivious.
It can be two things.
we know they are all cowards and they have a great historical excuse that makes funny jokes… their army rapes babies to death… they are going to learn a lesson in their quiet little apartments about shrugging their shoulders…
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Good point.
Yeah I’m not a huge fan of lumping everyone in the same bucket just because they all happened to have been born within the same lines on a map.
I’m sure there are some goose stepping citizens, some who hate the leadership with a passion and those who just want to get on with their lives and pay their bills.
Sadly armed resistance isn’t an easy thing to effectively get off the ground, especially in an authoritarian nation today. So the fact that there isn’t some wildly ambitious revolution ongoing, isn’t an indication that every resident is in agreement with the decisions their self appointed leaders are making.
At the memorial for Prigozhin, some lady said she was devastated, because he was one who could bring change to Russia.
They showed her face on TV… wonder if she’s doing well.
she has to worry for her safety because everyone around her is a coward… /shrug
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every Russian wakes up in a puddle of piss… a Russian can’t fall asleep at night unless he’s been given a good beating…
I dunno, if they were just afraid of speaking out, why even talk to the media? Though I can certainly imagine that many of the smarter people knew better than to talk, leaving only those with chronic foot-in-mouth syndrome to get interviewed.
The idiots probably believe the propaganda. Hell, we’ve scene over the last few years how prepared people are to believe someone who is charismatic even if they’re full of crap. Or just very loud.
Maybe they were blinking their eyes in morse code
Yeah, it’s dot dot dot dot dot dot.
“The
NazisRussians entered this war under the rather childish delusion that they were going to bomb everybody else and nobody was going to bomb them.”entered? you spelt “started” wrong
Besides being a quote as the other chap pointed out, to enter something in this manner doesn’t suggest they didn’t also start it, it’s quite acceptable grammatically.
Pip pip tally ho! *rides away into the sunset on Churchill’s back"
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you spelled “ruZZians” wrong
I don’t really think ordinary moscow residents are responsible for this war
There are some residents of Moscow that are definitely responsible for this war.
There are no residents of Ukraine that are responsible for this war.
They may be not guilty, but they are responsible. This is how wars work I believe.
Unless they’re not paying taxes, they are
I completely agree with you and find it sad you got downvoted.
These people live in a harsh dictatorship with nopress freedom. In such a state, they don’t have a say in what happens in many areas of their lives, let alone in the course of a war.
I don’t know if the ukrainian drones are targetting civilians, but if they are nothing makes it ok. We (the Allies) buried civilians under shells in Dresde during WWII and it has always disgusted me. These tactics might be efficient to bring morale down but they should imo never be used.
If Ukrainians generals want payback for what they have been going through in this fucking unjust, brutal and unjustified war, these drones might be better used targeting the rich mansions of Putin’s entourage.
I think the fact that they were so surprised speaks for itself. We all tend to underestimate how well propaganda works, including on ourselves.
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Back then we didn’t live in a police state with modern surveillance tech. It’s surprisingly difficult to organize a revolution when the medium of most social communication is readable by the gov without a warrant.
On the other hand I’m still amazed that those (yes I know they weren’t ever a revolution) Jan 6 clowns got as far as they did, considering they the relative capabilities of US and Russian domestic surveillance. Like that sort of thing has to have been organized on Facebook and telegram right?
That’s how America has salt dealt with the rest of the world for decades
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Could it be that the leopards have decided to turn around and eat our faces?
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I don’t get how a supposedly socialist instance shills so hard for an oligopoly run by a low grade Bond villain.
Because they were socialist for, like, ten minutes? Then went straight to totalitarianism?
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Yea not cheering on attacks on civilians are such shilling lol edit admin removed my previous comment as uncivil. I guess there is a big difference of being uncivil depending on the nationality of the victims. Fuckin libs
I bet the terrorists feel really stupid now knowing that two decades later they could just use drones.
Funny story . . .
So propaganda, government control over media, and threats against anyone who questions the government story works to control public reality and opinions.
Thanks Comrade Obvious.
they sent their fellow citizens and neighbors into Ukraine to rape and murder babies… they shouldn’t sleep another night in peace, ever again…
“they”
Ain’t exactly a representative democracy.
Doesn’t mean Moscow should be spared, just that the majority of the citizens didn’t have any say.
The ones loudly protesting are probably culpable though.
Russian leadership needs to be replaced, but the citizens didn’t ask for this. If your country went to war, what is there for you to do?
you just tried to equate “my country going to war” with “Russians intentionally raping babies to death”, and i don’t accept your equation…
if Russians had any honor they would feel the same, but they don’t… so i don’t care what happens to them, they deserve it…
You’re saying every Russian citizen has raped babies?
Most are just cowards that do nothing while it’s happening.
They can sleep in the subway until Putin is dead.
If you’re gonna be a coward, accept who you are and hide in a safe place while those with courage do what you what you were too scared to do.
You call them cowards for not doing anything but if push comes to shove I would put money on you doing jack shit too if you were in the same situation as the Russian people.
their ability to dodge is so natural, they don’t even realize they do it anymore
you really are unable to stop shrugging your shoulders, aren’t you… you must be Russian…
No I’m just not a psychopath and have empathy for the people of Russia since they didn’t choose this. War is just fucking shit for the people not in charge.
they can all rot in Hell
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Sucks to suck don’t it, Russia?
It’s kinda sad how misinformed many Russians are about what their state is up in Ukraine, and act like Ukraine has no right to fight back
Most of us just afraid. There’re more and more cases of prosecuting people for “discrediting Russian army”, for refusing to be conscripted and so on.
Fear of going to prison is almost in genes, due to the loong history of being heavily oppressed by own government.Is it better to lose life, freedom and loved ones in the pursuit of an unjust war in Ukraine that will provoke further violence at home? Or, is it better to direct violence at home against the ones who would send you or your loved ones to be killed fighting the Ukrainian people who themselves are just trying to defend their loved ones and their homes?
If you are too afraid and unwilling to fight back against the architects of your current torment, are you not already imprisoned?
If you are too afraid and unwilling to fight back against the architects of your current torment, are you not already imprisoned?
That’s a lofty sophism. There’s a huge difference between some philosophical imprisonment and a real one.
You are right. That’s fair.
You know, as an American, I have difficulty trying to figure out how to react and resist against my country’s imperialistic endeavors, among other things. Many other things. I think our police probably share more qualities with yours than they have differences, as one for instance.
But, I think that, again, when family and friends, neighbors and loved ones are being conscripted in a draft and killed in a war that isn’t even a matter of self-defense, but that is also inviting retaliation closer to home that philosophy becomes much less lofty. Much more practical.
When you are being forced into seriously unjust actions that invite current harm AND future harm, that calculus seems much easier to figure out. When there is already harm being directed at you by your government, the path of less harm might just be taking direct action to solve that source of all the attendant problems.
I sincerely hope the Russian people can find a way to limit the harms their government is targeting them with. And, that they find a way to prosper and contribute and enjoy both the fruits of their labor AND their renewed place in a world that can similarly find itself on a better track. Because, honestly, humanity as whole is a fucking mess and we all need each other right now and going forward.
Secret of passivity of an average Russian is in eternal “maybe” in our heads: maybe government won’t notice me, maybe I will be spared, maybe a situation will fix itself somehow. We even have special term for it: “авось”.
It’s all learned helplessness.As for me personally - I have decided that if they will try to conscript me then I will try to flee or go to prison rather than actively participate in that war.
I’m sorry to hear it’s like that, and sad to report it’s getting that way here, more and more; though we don’t have a word for it, yet.
You sound like a good person. Glad to have chatted. Best luck.
So it looks like you think “maybe” it is not going to affect you, and you are only willing to do anything once it does. I think that is in general how everyone there thinks. “Maybe it won’t affect me” but by the time it does it is already too late to react. If you want to flee, do it now. Don’t wait for the “maybe”. Because if you do, it will be too late to react.
Over 100,000 dead Russian soldiers paid with their lives. What did that accomplish?
Amazing how the wagnerites drove 3/4 the way to Moscow and then gave up. They can’t even coup, when they hold all the cards.
Plus, most Russians are fucking FOR the war.
Over 100,000 dead Russian soldiers paid with their lives. What did that accomplish?
I don’t know. Why are you asking me?
Plus, most Russians are fucking FOR the war.
I don’t know where you take that one from. It’s not like we can have independent polls here in Russia and people a certainly don’t feel safe to answer honestly.
I, of course, only have anecdotes, but very few people I know support war.
It’s very sad. They are locked into informational echo chambers that only repeat the words of state media and anyone repeating anything else gets arrested or a ‘visit’. The only ones who know how to bypass this are mostly younger tech savvy Russians with VPNs etc who care enough.
Arrests and visits are not that widespread yet. Problems are atomization of society and lack of trust, that doesn’t help organizing for literally anything too. Someone in higher comment remembered the long and hardly broken by 90s history of opression, but there’s an old anecdote: ‘If Stalin is such a monster, who sniched on others millions of times?’. If you don’t vet a person\company before dropping heavy topics and opinions, they can tell on you just out of spite. On a local, small people level, folks aren’t found out by secret services, they are snitched on. A girl painted a pro-peace picture and teacher called a police, resulting in her father imprisoned and her put into shelter. Some guy overheard a couple talking in a cafe and boyfriend was pressed face-to-floor before they had a chance to leave. Some college students snitched on a classmate just for lulz to FSB and she got a prison sentence out of blue, she was 19. It’s despicable, but these facts aren’t systemic oppression, but rather ugly POSes having a new leverage over others. When Zs are plastered everywhere, you aren’t really sure who’d hear you at all times.
Telegram is very widespread and not blocked (while most VPNs are). Many under 45 follow the situation there, see videos and news. They just don’t know what to do with that, to fully comprehend what’s going on themselves and see their role in it, and totally unlikely to talk about it publicly. It’s going back to close kitchen talks of later USSR. Everyone understands everything, but mantra comes to mind. Not many take a hard stance now, but try to put together a Frankenstein’s creature of conflicting thoughts\bits of information to somehow explain the situation (like the viral beheading done by Wagner), or isolate themselves from it altogether to keep moving. Only to then get very surprised, when this thrown away and long forgotten puzzle suddenly blows up under their bed.
A very weird place to observe.
That’s the brave new world: everyone and everything has a digital trace now and therefore is transparent to oppressive government. A world of a dream for a dictator.
I mean genuinely it’s the chapter in 1984 where his idiot buddies kid snitched him out to Big Brother. It’s a human personality trait, and one that’s always there.
Yes, it is. But you too, are in a bubble, if you think this petty vandalism is “fighting back”
It’s not about doing damage. It’s about reminding Russians that the only reason civilians aren’t dying in Moscow is because Ukraine chooses not to stoop to Russia’s level.
Okay, that sounds reasonable. But if that’s the case, why don’t they blow up something of strategic value? I’m sure there are some military factories around Moscow that they could blow up overnight without causing any civilian harm. That’d honestly be quite badass.
But to me it sounds like they don’t actually have the capacity to do so. No drone has an ability to reach from Kiyv to Moscow, so those attacks are likely done by local partisans who jerry rigged off the shelf drones with diy explosives. Those wont be able to do any serious damage other than making flashy headlines.
They did. That happened. Just a few weeks ago.
The blast took place at Zagorsk Optical and Mechanical Plant, in the town of Sergiev Posad, TASS reported. The plant is a developer and manufacturer for optical and optoelectronic devices for the Russian military, law enforcement agencies, industry and healthcare.
source link: https://www.cnn.com/2023/08/09/europe/moscow-industrial-plant-blast-intl/index.html
second source: https://www.theguardian.com/world/2023/aug/09/huge-explosion-firework-factory-sergiev-posad-near-moscowIt’s not yet clear whether this was of Ukrainian doing or just coincidence. If they can blow one they can certainly blow a few more. If it’s actually them and they keep at it, It’ll definitely change my position on this whole situation I’ll even edit all of my comments to say how wrong I was.
I feel so bad for them.
Wtf is a husker pat?
Being tackled by a Nebraska corn husker football player?
This presumes they can actually complete the tackle.
I don’t know what he means, but in Danish it means “remembers tit”.
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Honestly I hate the way this article is written, like yeah, let’s dunk on some random Russian citizens for complaining when things are worse in Ukraine. As if they have some kind of say in what Putin and his cronies are up to. I’m not against the Ukrainian drone attacks, but we need to stop with this general anti-Russian sentiment.
we need to stop with this general anti-Russian sentiment.
Let us know when Russia stops committing war crimes and gets the fuck out of Ukraine. Until then, STFU.
And returns all the people it stole, and all the POWs.
And rebuilds all the stuff it wrecked, and pays reparations for all the people it killed
Whether you like it or not people are going to carry resentment towards the Russians, as it’s their government that is over in Ukraine literally committing war crimes.
It’s the irony of Russians complaining when Ukraine does even an iota of punching back that frustrates people.
By framing it as an attack on Moscow instead of the result of Russia invading Ukraine, they have shown they are complicit. Fuck 'em.
What you should have said was nothing.
Umm, no. Fuck Russia.
Yeah everyone in the world has to deal with Putin the poisoner… except the Russian people. We can’t possibly expect the Russian people to deal with that shithead. Nope, it’s Putin is the responsibility of everyone in the world other the the people of Russia!
If Russians don’t like anti-Russian sentiment then they can start doing something about the guy that’s in their Kremlin that’s fucking everything up for everyone else.
America had its turn when it invaded Iraq. Americans started wearing Canadian patches when traveling aboard. Iraq wasn’t as bad as Ukrane. American turned on support for the war after 2 years. Russia has an election coming up. They should use it - even if it is rigged.
I hate to be a Russian whataboutist but the American record of antiwar protest isn’t stellar either. Imo the closer comparison is Vietnam, that was the last one where we were forced to draft people. And it did result in significant protests from multiple groups (incomparable to Iraq imo. What exactly did the Iraq protests 2 years in accomplish, again?)
The vietnam protests were actively suppressed by intelligence services and ultimately followed in the 80s by a wave of reactionary public sentiment that set the tone for republican politics even to this day (and we can all see how well that’s going).
Lol, let the xenophobia flow through your down votes. This is what you get for having a normal take. Americans love to hate other populations based on what their corrupt governments do. Ignorance is life here.
We are not all American, and I will not stand for that level of insult.
“Normal take” my ass.
Just owning up to being a piece of shit lmao
You can be against Russia and the war on Ukraine and still realize that the majority of Russian citizens didn’t ask for this and don’t want it.
It’s the same thing as hating all Americans when they invaded Iraq and Afghanistan (and then overstayed by a decade and a half).
But nuance is a little too much to ask for right? Just need to be on the hate train 24/7.
Can you please understand that my issue is when you and every other American make everything and everyone around you an American. Get out of here with your whataboutizums and assuming you have a say on who I dislike.
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Ah nice, nothing said but lots of insults. You think Lemmy is American? Where is .world situated again?
Go ahead look me up, its a feature of the site after all.
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