Im fairly certain that what I’m about to say will be disliked by ketamine users and abstainers.
Ketamine is garbage at everything besides temporarily lobotomizing people. It works for it’s many uses because it makes the user stupid. It’s often given to suicidal people, not because it’s a miracle drug, but because it incapacitates them in a safe manner.
That said, it’s great at making people too stupid to be able to hurt themselves, most of the time. It’s great at numbing psychological pain because the user will be too stupid to conceptualize their own thoughts or realize where they are physically.
It’s also hard on the urinary system and has a fleeting high.
If you like ketamine then by all means, you do you. If you may be interested in trying ketamine, become a zombie safely, just don’t expect it to cure your depression, woes, or any of your other problems.
Yeah, I’m gonna take the peer reviewed studies results that show that ketamine is quite effective with relieving drug resistant depression over this post of yours…
It is useful in creating a sense of disassociation of self - the same thing that meditation does. It even affects the same regions of the brain as meditation. When used carefully, with therapeutic intent, it can be an effective treatment for depression.
Recreational use is sketchy, definitely. But the science is there for using it therapeutically.
I have no dog in this fight, but any studies done on brain chemistry and psychological effects need to be taken with a grain of salt. We know so little about the brain and consciousness that most of the stuff we’re trying and doing are educated guesses.
Ketamine is garbage at everything besides temporarily lobotomizing people. It works for it’s many uses because it makes the user stupid. It’s often given to suicidal people, not because it’s a miracle drug, but because it incapacitates them in a safe manner.
This quote from you contradicts what you’ve just said.
It doesn’t. I can speak to it’s mode of action without speaking to it’s reason of use or efficacy. It’s highly effective. It’s great at what it’s used for. It also temporarily makes the user stupid and incapacitates them.
It also doesn’t make you stupid, it is a disassociative anesthetic so you lose touch, to varying degrees, of your senses. At high enough doses even your sense of hearing becomes strange and I would bet if my doc gave me more it would fail almost completely. That’s not a place I want to go however.
Despite that, and appearing to be incapable of coordinated movement or speech, the mind is still active. Altered, yes. But active and intact. I am always aware of my partner in the room/bed with me, the dog checking things out, I just choose not to interact with them to continue exploring memories, or alien landscapes, or just turn off my mind, listen to the music, and let the drug work while the most fantastic and surreal images come and go.
I’m here today because of ketamine. Disinformation and pearl clutching threatens to reduce access to it, and could cost lives, speaking only of this one niche use.
I’m not trying to diminish anyone’s experiences with ketamine, or reduce anyone’s access to it, though I do think it’s funny everyone thinks that some asshole on the internet has that ability.
Are you able to stand up when using ketamine? How about run? Could you tell me your personal details such as name/date/address? Could you tell me the time? Could you remember your mother’s phone number? Could you take a bath? Could you safely use a knife? Could you melt into nothingness and lose all sense of self, physicality and emotion?..wait strike that last one. Of course you could.
Now we’re at the point that we all realize dissociation is to become stupid and incapacitated. Anesthitized even?
Ahhhhh, so you did come back to say more dumb stuff. I literally baby sat a group of friends on the stuff two weekends ago. Sure, they said some amusing things, but at least 95% of what they said was perfectly coherent and made sense. As evidenced by one of them saying “you know you’re getting old when you have more cos you’re lower back starts to ache”. By your description, that should not have been possible. Yet it was. Sure, you enter a k-hole and you’re good for nothing, but most K experiences don’t enter that and people can function fine enough on it - like most drugs the intensity of effect is dose dependent. But like I said in a previous comment, you seem to be stuck in the 1950s and their anti drugs hysteria.
Your friends were so stupid on ketamine that they needed a babysitter.
Let me just point out a few things. You could have said “in that case, all drugs make you stupid” which would have been totally valid. You could have said “at the dosage necessary to incapacitate someone, of course they would be stupid”, which of course is valid.
The whole point of my very first comment was to poke at people who love ketamine, and also those who read studies about ketamine and proceed to spread it like gospel.
There isn’t a recreational drug that exists that makes anyone temporarily smarter. They all make us temporarily more stupid. For some reason drug users get real uppity when you point that out, especially about their drug of choice. That’s not to say that something can’t be taken from the experience that helps someone, or that might inherently make them smarter or self aware. I was just simply stating that when on that drug, you are more stupid. I think that’s a lesson that a lot of drug users should be more aware of.
I’ve seen a lot of dumb shit happen because someone was mislead about a drugs effects. Hell, I have some K in a stash right now, but let’s not misguide people into thinking they will just be coherent floating brains. They may also be floppy dumb messes that may need babysitting for 45 minutes. Will they be just as smart afterward? Probably. But for those 45 minutes they are going to be stupid.
Good on you for being a trip sitter. You’re good people. People deserve to try drugs in a safe manner and that’s what leads to good experiences. Those good experiences are what those stupid people deserve.
You didn’t though. You used a blanket statement. As evidenced by your use of the word “everything”. Your entire initial comment reads as if it was written in the grip of anti drugs hysteria in the 1950s and shows none of the nuance you’re now trying to claim it does.
You’re also wrong on its mode of action, so you’re not even speaking to that. It doesn’t work by making the user “too stupid to conceptualize their own thoughts or realize where they are physically”.
I would add to this that anyone doing ketamine should not do it in the bath, which seems to be what happened here. The same happened to someone I knew, she drowned in the tub.
MDMA not worth it? It’s euphoria and love in a pill, not addictive, and quite safe when you do not abuse it. Millions of people use it and have been using it for about half a century and the vast majority of it restricts it to when they’re partying with few side effects. I think you misjudge its use a bit.
Yes it can be acutely abused because you’re chasing the dragon on nights that you do use it, but that is also a result of its illegal nature and a lack of education.
Of the chemical variants of drugs, I’d say it’s probably one of the few that is actually worth it, besides LSD.
Yeah, I try to tell people that there’s value in MDMA beyond just a night out dancing. My favorite times have been on a couch with friends, getting deep into one another and kind of exploring your minds. I’ve had some incredibly important and memorable conversations with people that I was able to become very close with because MDMA let us drop the walls and talk about things, which is something I cannot do face to face with someone sober. And I’m not an introvert by any stretch, I have no problem being the center of a conversation, I have no problem listening to others, but opening up about personal issues was something MDMA let me do, and say things I never could put into words.
I’ve also stood in front of a wall of speakers and had bright lights and bass music thrown at me, and that’s also fun.
Hmmm, I don’t know the second one but mdma is great fun. Of course you have to be in a good state of mind before trying, but it’s a potent empathogen that has its uses.
One of the most fun nights of my life is when I went to visit a friend at his university, we took some and he immediately ended up with some girl and disappeared on me.
So I decided that I would just wander his campus looking for parties. I took shots with frat boys, danced with some gays guy out dressed in drag, played chess with some guy on the quad (he would have destroyed me even if I was sober), found another friend and went and partied with her and her lesbian friends (“wait you’re a lesbian now?” “Maybe not sure”) and then made the biggest mistake of my life when I turned down joining them when I was making a hasty exit after I noticed one of the girls was eating the other out right next to me on the couch.
My experience is very vanilla coming after yours, but we had some of that and spent the entire night in my last floor apartment just chatting and drinking looking at the sea. It was full moon too. At one point I must have thought it was around midnight, I peeked at the east-facing window in my room and a big ball of fire was burning on the horizon. Time really flew this night…
Im fairly certain that what I’m about to say will be disliked by ketamine users and abstainers.
Ketamine is garbage at everything besides temporarily lobotomizing people. It works for it’s many uses because it makes the user stupid. It’s often given to suicidal people, not because it’s a miracle drug, but because it incapacitates them in a safe manner.
That said, it’s great at making people too stupid to be able to hurt themselves, most of the time. It’s great at numbing psychological pain because the user will be too stupid to conceptualize their own thoughts or realize where they are physically.
It’s also hard on the urinary system and has a fleeting high.
If you like ketamine then by all means, you do you. If you may be interested in trying ketamine, become a zombie safely, just don’t expect it to cure your depression, woes, or any of your other problems.
Yeah, I’m gonna take the peer reviewed studies results that show that ketamine is quite effective with relieving drug resistant depression over this post of yours…
It is useful in creating a sense of disassociation of self - the same thing that meditation does. It even affects the same regions of the brain as meditation. When used carefully, with therapeutic intent, it can be an effective treatment for depression.
Recreational use is sketchy, definitely. But the science is there for using it therapeutically.
But your assessment of its efficacy is not contradictory to DontHavePants observation. They didn’t say it wasn’t effective.
I have no dog in this fight, but any studies done on brain chemistry and psychological effects need to be taken with a grain of salt. We know so little about the brain and consciousness that most of the stuff we’re trying and doing are educated guesses.
And random social media text posts need to be taken with a cargo ship’s load worth of salt.
Nothing I said is in any contention with ketamine/depression studies.
This quote from you contradicts what you’ve just said.
It doesn’t. I can speak to it’s mode of action without speaking to it’s reason of use or efficacy. It’s highly effective. It’s great at what it’s used for. It also temporarily makes the user stupid and incapacitates them.
That isn’t it’s mode of action, at all.
It also doesn’t make you stupid, it is a disassociative anesthetic so you lose touch, to varying degrees, of your senses. At high enough doses even your sense of hearing becomes strange and I would bet if my doc gave me more it would fail almost completely. That’s not a place I want to go however.
Despite that, and appearing to be incapable of coordinated movement or speech, the mind is still active. Altered, yes. But active and intact. I am always aware of my partner in the room/bed with me, the dog checking things out, I just choose not to interact with them to continue exploring memories, or alien landscapes, or just turn off my mind, listen to the music, and let the drug work while the most fantastic and surreal images come and go.
I’m here today because of ketamine. Disinformation and pearl clutching threatens to reduce access to it, and could cost lives, speaking only of this one niche use.
deleted by creator
Again, you’re not actually contradicting Pants, you’re just rewording and massaging their snark.
I’ve ingested a ton of ketamine myself, so theres no pearl clutching here. I’ll be back tomorrow to continue arguing semantics.
I’m not trying to diminish anyone’s experiences with ketamine, or reduce anyone’s access to it, though I do think it’s funny everyone thinks that some asshole on the internet has that ability.
Are you able to stand up when using ketamine? How about run? Could you tell me your personal details such as name/date/address? Could you tell me the time? Could you remember your mother’s phone number? Could you take a bath? Could you safely use a knife? Could you melt into nothingness and lose all sense of self, physicality and emotion?..wait strike that last one. Of course you could.
Now we’re at the point that we all realize dissociation is to become stupid and incapacitated. Anesthitized even?
Ahhhhh, so you did come back to say more dumb stuff. I literally baby sat a group of friends on the stuff two weekends ago. Sure, they said some amusing things, but at least 95% of what they said was perfectly coherent and made sense. As evidenced by one of them saying “you know you’re getting old when you have more cos you’re lower back starts to ache”. By your description, that should not have been possible. Yet it was. Sure, you enter a k-hole and you’re good for nothing, but most K experiences don’t enter that and people can function fine enough on it - like most drugs the intensity of effect is dose dependent. But like I said in a previous comment, you seem to be stuck in the 1950s and their anti drugs hysteria.
Your friends were so stupid on ketamine that they needed a babysitter.
Let me just point out a few things. You could have said “in that case, all drugs make you stupid” which would have been totally valid. You could have said “at the dosage necessary to incapacitate someone, of course they would be stupid”, which of course is valid.
The whole point of my very first comment was to poke at people who love ketamine, and also those who read studies about ketamine and proceed to spread it like gospel.
There isn’t a recreational drug that exists that makes anyone temporarily smarter. They all make us temporarily more stupid. For some reason drug users get real uppity when you point that out, especially about their drug of choice. That’s not to say that something can’t be taken from the experience that helps someone, or that might inherently make them smarter or self aware. I was just simply stating that when on that drug, you are more stupid. I think that’s a lesson that a lot of drug users should be more aware of.
I’ve seen a lot of dumb shit happen because someone was mislead about a drugs effects. Hell, I have some K in a stash right now, but let’s not misguide people into thinking they will just be coherent floating brains. They may also be floppy dumb messes that may need babysitting for 45 minutes. Will they be just as smart afterward? Probably. But for those 45 minutes they are going to be stupid.
Good on you for being a trip sitter. You’re good people. People deserve to try drugs in a safe manner and that’s what leads to good experiences. Those good experiences are what those stupid people deserve.
You didn’t though. You used a blanket statement. As evidenced by your use of the word “everything”. Your entire initial comment reads as if it was written in the grip of anti drugs hysteria in the 1950s and shows none of the nuance you’re now trying to claim it does.
You’re also wrong on its mode of action, so you’re not even speaking to that. It doesn’t work by making the user “too stupid to conceptualize their own thoughts or realize where they are physically”.
He said everything except “temporarily lobotomizing people” which was clearly hyperbole.
He then gave examples where the sedation provided by ketamine can be beneficial.
This guy gets it.
There are so many overly pedantic haters that recently joined Lemmy. Every post now is controversial as fuck judging by the downvoting going on.
I would add to this that anyone doing ketamine should not do it in the bath, which seems to be what happened here. The same happened to someone I knew, she drowned in the tub.
Any drug close water where you can drown is a recipe for disaster. Someone I knew pop an acid tab at the beach and drown itself.
Agreed. Don’t get lobotomized in any body of water.
Ketamine is definitely up there with ‘hip’ drugs not worth trying.
Along with MDMA and Xanax.
I don’t really respect anyone who does these because they’re usually living a lifestyle that leads to nowhere.
MDMA not worth it? It’s euphoria and love in a pill, not addictive, and quite safe when you do not abuse it. Millions of people use it and have been using it for about half a century and the vast majority of it restricts it to when they’re partying with few side effects. I think you misjudge its use a bit.
Yes it can be acutely abused because you’re chasing the dragon on nights that you do use it, but that is also a result of its illegal nature and a lack of education.
Of the chemical variants of drugs, I’d say it’s probably one of the few that is actually worth it, besides LSD.
Yeah, I try to tell people that there’s value in MDMA beyond just a night out dancing. My favorite times have been on a couch with friends, getting deep into one another and kind of exploring your minds. I’ve had some incredibly important and memorable conversations with people that I was able to become very close with because MDMA let us drop the walls and talk about things, which is something I cannot do face to face with someone sober. And I’m not an introvert by any stretch, I have no problem being the center of a conversation, I have no problem listening to others, but opening up about personal issues was something MDMA let me do, and say things I never could put into words.
I’ve also stood in front of a wall of speakers and had bright lights and bass music thrown at me, and that’s also fun.
Hmmm, I don’t know the second one but mdma is great fun. Of course you have to be in a good state of mind before trying, but it’s a potent empathogen that has its uses.
One of the most fun nights of my life is when I went to visit a friend at his university, we took some and he immediately ended up with some girl and disappeared on me.
So I decided that I would just wander his campus looking for parties. I took shots with frat boys, danced with some gays guy out dressed in drag, played chess with some guy on the quad (he would have destroyed me even if I was sober), found another friend and went and partied with her and her lesbian friends (“wait you’re a lesbian now?” “Maybe not sure”) and then made the biggest mistake of my life when I turned down joining them when I was making a hasty exit after I noticed one of the girls was eating the other out right next to me on the couch.
wild 😁 Yea I get how you’d want a do over heheh
My experience is very vanilla coming after yours, but we had some of that and spent the entire night in my last floor apartment just chatting and drinking looking at the sea. It was full moon too. At one point I must have thought it was around midnight, I peeked at the east-facing window in my room and a big ball of fire was burning on the horizon. Time really flew this night…