• @Salph
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    924 months ago

    cannot be equated with terrorism

    The only terrorists here are the “israeli” militants.

    • idkmybffjoeysteel [he/him]
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      334 months ago

      love how that guy who climbed the fence and got shot by his own guys on the walk back wasn’t considered a terrorist by the media despite 1) being a lone wolf and 2) not operating as part of an authorised military action. I suppose that latter point is because all Israeli’s take part in an authorised military action as an occupying force every second of every day.

      • @Salph
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        4 months ago

        Cuz words like that are usually used for countries, while “israel” is just a western colony in Palestine.

        • Log1cal_Outcome
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          -134 months ago

          I mean, Jewish people originally heralded from around the eastern Mediterranean, middle east? That would make them historically middle eastern rather than western. Or are we strictly talking about western powers giving the Jewish people a ‘homeland’ after the second world war and the holocaust?

          • 420blazeit69 [he/him]
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            4 months ago

            Let’s set aside the multiple issues with “I think one of my distant ancestors lived here 2000 years ago, or maybe just other members of my religious group, therefore I have a right to live here today” and assume that yes, that sort of historical/ancestral claim gives comtemporary Jewish people a right to live in Palestine. Even in the most generous light imaginable, it would not give them a right to build an ethnostate by committing genocide on the current inhabitants. Israel is so far past anything that could be reasonably granted from ancient Jews living in Palestine that there is no possible defense along those lines.

            Or are we strictly talking about western powers giving the Jewish people a ‘homeland’ after the second world war and the holocaust?

            Yes, that’s what people mean when they refer to Israel as a colony of Europe/the U.S.

              • SoyViking [he/him]
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                424 months ago

                Did apartheid South Africa have a right to defend itself? Did Rhodesia? Did French Algeria?

                No. Regimes like these have one right: The right to be thrown in the dustbin of history and to be replaced by a more just order.

              • 420blazeit69 [he/him]
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                394 months ago

                Israel is making it’s own decisions and will happily shrug off any criticism from the Western powers

                There has been zero sincere criticism from the West. If you circumvent Congress to give Israel more money and openly state you are unconditionally supporting it, I don’t buy it if you leak a story about being furious with them behind closed doors. You shouldn’t, either.

            • @NeatNit@discuss.tchncs.de
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              4 months ago

              The giant gaping hole in calling Israel a “western colony” is that it has no homeland. It’s not a British colony, or a French colony, or a colony of any other country. If Israel as a country stops existing, the vast majority of its citizens don’t have citizenship in any other country and have literally nowhere else to go. Therefore it’s not a colony and it’s not colonialism, it’s an independent country.

              • 420blazeit69 [he/him]
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                384 months ago

                When the British expelled criminals to Australia they couldn’t return home. Was Australia not a colony? A ton of European immigrants to the American colonies intended their journeys to be one-way trips, and were functionally barred from returning by cost. Does that mean there were no colonies in the Americas?

                Besides, throughout history you almost never see settlers leaving en masse when colonial administrations end. Sure, some recent arrivees may turn around, and some administrators who moved there mostly to work in the colonial government may leave, but you really never see the main body of settlers leave. You didn’t even have this in South Africa. They simply have to live under a government where they can’t shoot the locals with impunity.

                • @NeatNit@discuss.tchncs.de
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                  -144 months ago

                  That doesn’t really address the point though… Israel is independent, and was so from the start. It’s not bound to any other western country’s rule, which is the first requirement for being a colony.

                  • 420blazeit69 [he/him]
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                    364 months ago

                    the vast majority of its citizens don’t have citizenship in any other country and have literally nowhere else to go. Therefore it’s not a colony

                    It directly refutes this.

                    If you’re leaning on Israel being formally independent, they’re about as independent from the West (particularly the U.S.) as a college freshman getting their tuition paid by Mom and Dad. No one here is talking about Israel being independent on paper, we’re talking about how it interacts with other countries in reality.

              • idkmybffjoeysteel [he/him]
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                384 months ago

                Sure I was born in Britain with British citizenship, but I identify as Middle Eastern so I should be granted somebody else’s land where they are currently living.

                These people should be blasted into fucking space if they need a homeland so badly. Zionism cannot even exist without the antisemitic belief in a fifth column. Are Jews an alien element in Western society, or do they belong to the societies in which they were born?

                I will tell you this: Middle Eastern people do not eat schnitzel.

              • GarbageShoot [he/him]
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                344 months ago

                You know that many Israelis did come from anglosphere or now-EU states, right? It’s not like it’s just a new social formation of people who already lived in the region.

          • Bnova [he/him]
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            484 months ago

            Can I just lay claim to random pieces of land in Africa? I mean all people came from there at one point right?

          • idkmybffjoeysteel [he/him]
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            434 months ago

            I declare all of Sweden a homeland for the oppressed Stalinists (I have an incredibly remote connection to Norse settlers along with almost everyone else in my country)

          • GarbageShoot [he/him]
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            374 months ago

            It’s a project overwhelmingly lead by western states that has resulted in a huge importing of people who were born and raised in western states pretending they are indigenous to the region. If not for the west, Israel would neither have the resources to maintain its colonial project nor the population needed for occupying Palestine.

    • MamboGator
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      14 months ago

      Apparently the mods deleted my comment because they didn’t like me pointing out that this guy’s entire post history is defending Russia’s invasion of Ukraine and China’s genocide of Uyghur Muslims, even though his entire post history is defending Russia’s invasion of Ukraine and China’s genocide of Uyghur Muslims.

      Don’t you think that’s odd?

    • @random9@lemmy.world
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      4 months ago

      I do not support the current actions of the Israeli government but it is wildely disingenuous to believe that the “only terrorists here” are the Israeli. The Hamas are also terrorists.

      They attacked, killed, beat, and in all likelyhood tortured and raped unarmed civilians. They have previously publically stated that their goal is to exterminate all Jews. They are terrorists with genocidal goals.

      I don’t support the current actions of the Israeli government in Palestine, but every time I see thee posts they are very one sided. Amidst those who oppose Israel and also oppose violence and genocide from both sides, often hide pure anti-semites who are using this opportunity to push for the extermination of all Jews. Neither that nor the current actions of Israel are acceptable.

      I can’t believe this comment sating that the “only” terrorists are the Israeli has gotten so many upvotes.

      • @Salph
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        4 months ago

        Hamas’s strategies are no different from the Viet Cong’s; attacking villages, taking hostages, using tunnels and guerilla warfare) and they have the same goals (driving out foreign occupiers and reuniting their country). Was this “terrorism”?

        By this logic the Warsaw Ghetto Uprising was also terrorism since, regardless of its intentions and goals, it resulted in the deaths of thousands of Jews at the hands of the nazis similar to how Palestinians are being killed by “israel” now after the Oct 7 operations.

        their goal is to exterminate all Jews

        You’re consuming too much zionist propaganda.

        Hamas 2017 charter:

        1. Hamas affirms that its conflict is with the Zionist project not with the Jews because of their religion. Hamas does not wage a struggle against the Jews because they are Jewish but wages a struggle against the Zionists who occupy Palestine. Yet, it is the Zionists who constantly identify Judaism and the Jews with their own colonial project and illegal entity.

        Hamas is currently the largest Palestinian armed resistance group (and was even directly elected by the people of Gaza at that) and deserves everyone’s support. Both-siding this in any way just because Hamas has flaws is not much different from both-siding with nazi Germany; even more so since zionism is a continuation of nazism, with the same goal of getting Jewish people out of Europe and weaponizing and exacerbating antisemitism.

      • @TheAnonymouseJoker@lemmy.ml
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        164 months ago

        Just for the record, this poster is from Zionist instance Lemmyworld, loves Marvel US military propaganda, hates Russia and pretends to love Uyghurs while being okay with Palestine genocide.

        • @Omega_Haxors@lemmy.ml
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          4 months ago

          I knew that LW admins were trying to make the place into a nazi bar but they seriously going full zionist already? Dammmn!

          • @Alsephina@lemmy.mlOP
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            94 months ago

            I remember seeing an actual, genocide denying zionazi in that instance with the fucking zionist flag in their username

            • @Doods
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              14 months ago

              The term Zionazi implies the Zionism isn’t enough on its own, but take my uovotr nevertheless.

              • @Alsephina@lemmy.mlOP
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                44 months ago

                It’s meant to relate the two, which is reasonable since both have the goal of getting Jewish people out of Europe, zionists were supported by antisemites, and there are lots of actual straight up nazis in the “israeli” military.